Dialogue: Why do we wish at all? | Meditative Diaries

TO LIVE IS TO DIE

wishes

Dialogue: Why do we wish at all?

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Its the first time there was not any disturbance with the huge wave of wishes because of the New Year’s day and it seems there was also much understanding on the whole movement of wish. The dialogue below was rather enlightening for the writer.. :

  • George: Doesn’t a wish imply hope? And obviously fear?
  • Heather: Maybe just desire
  • George: Desire hope fear, all a unified movement.. so why do we send wishes at all?
  • Heather: Why do anything? Ha ha
  • George: Probably because we love to.. with no hope, no fear, no expectation, no compulsion, not mechanically.
  • Heather: Are you speaking of wishing something for someone else? Like lovingkindness meditations?
  • George: I think every wish doesn’t make sense – sorry i don’t mean to sound odd, spiritual or anything like that.. i just ask
  • Chan Chan: Within the desire to fulfill the wish exists the contrary possibility of fear of the wish or desire not being fulfilled. Maybe one needs to look at the rising of wish, or the rising of the desire to move away from what is
  • Heather: Sometimes I’m at peace with what is and i still wish for more peace. Have looked at your child and imagined happiness in its future? It’s a nice experience
  • George: Yet based on imagination, on what was or what should be.. wouldn’t you agree on that? Sorry i don’t mean to disturb you at all!
  • Heather: Does it matter if it comes from imagination? Really beautiful things start there. Not only that but the act of wishing for peace from a place of equanimity is transforming to the person wishing
  • George: I am not sure if imagination has nothing to do with art, with expression, with spontaneity.. it seems imagination is shaped from the past.. spontaneous action (in art or in everyday relationship) seems to be a joyful, beautiful thing… i think imagination is something completely different (i am not sure, we may inquire together)
  • Heather: Maybe it varies by context? If i wish peace for the world could that be shaped by the past? Always? And would that necessarily be a bad thing?
  • George: I think yes its always shaped by the past because you refer to the concept, the idea of peace.. i wouldn’t evaluate it as good or bad.. i would rather say its a factor that gives birth to division (what is -> what should be)
  • Heather: Okay i get the past thing, sort of. But I’m not so sure about the ‘should’ piece. Can you wish for something without the context of ‘should’? The Buddha didn’t say should, he said “may”
  • George: A wish reminds me of the vicious game played inside every time i see (for example) there is anger and there is also judgement (i shouldn’t be angry now).. probably you say “i wish you a peaceful life” and you imply “i ask you to see if its possible to live an actually peaceful life..” .. this doesn’t sound neurotic at all.
  • Heather: I completely understand what you’re saying. I experience that neurotic kind of wanting things to be different more often than not. I also think there’s a kind of pure wish. It’s not even an asking for something. There’s not really anything to do, even. It’s more an acknowledgement of what the possibility is. It’s hard to articulate.George: This makes sense.. words are always limited
  • Heather: If you see a man who is suffering, you may feel compassion and wish his suffering to end. It’s a natural response to being present. You may not be suffering over his suffering. You may just have a wish for his well being. Not even in your mind but in your body
  • George: In such case probably an action of compassion is what would naturally happen..
  • Heather: And wouldn’t that natural act of compassion come out of the wish?
  • George: I think this act of compassion would rise before a word would appear..
  • Heather: Would we want a world in which no one ever wished? I think that would be unnatural, wouldn’t it?
  • George: I am not sure a world where wishes don’t exist is something not good.. aaah this just came.. probably to say “how pitty that this man is suffering” or “i wish this man’s suffering stops now” is a convenient escape..
  • Heather: I think maybe not the wish but the desire would come before the act.But the idea of metta meditation is to cultivate desire for peace in oneself
  • George:Meditation techniques don’t make sense at all, at least this moment, for me
  • Heather: I don’t know what to say except that a world without any wish or desire for health would make no sense to me. If there are no separate forms, it would be like not wanting your own well being. To me, that makes no sense.
  • George: You’re right this is how things are! i am not idealizing here, i just ask if wish is by nature a conflicting movement
  • Heather: Also, it is not The Way Things Are. We do wish. That is what is. So it must make sense, no?
  • George: No, not really.. i also kill people to gather sources i won’t be able to use before i die.. it is what it is, but i think it doesn’t make sense.. you say no?
  • Heather: It doesn’t make sense to the mind, no. There is not one tiny piece of you that wishes you didn’t kill?
  • George: Exactly, this is what i want to get at.. our fragmented ego is jealous and at the moment wishes we weren’t jealous, kills and at the same moment wishes we wouldn’t kill, dominates and wishes we wouldn’t dominate.. immense division, contradiction.. it seems like wish perpetuates contradiction
  • Heather: And that makes no sense to us. So what if we could accept that and also want to do what makes sense?
  • George: Probably its not something to accept or not.. just to see it and the seeing itself will bring about a transformation on its own
  • Heather: I guess i am not suitable for the conversation because i still want peace. I’m not there
  • George: Aren’t there moments that you don’t desire anything? to say “i am not there” probably creates another image for you
  • Heather: But if no one had ever wanted to get there faster, there’d be no bicycles
  • George: i think thought in technological/practical things does make sense!
  • Heather: Not having something to work toward feels scary and irresponsible. It feels like no me
  • George: This emotion is very common to me
  • Heather: Strange that it could be that i can know the peace of no self enough to work toward it almost constantly and, at the same time, be so terrified of it
  • George: Awareness dissolves this scary emotion, i’ve seen it. But you need to see it on your own (this is not a motivational boost)
  • Heather: I have had moments of awareness on several occasions but i always return to being Heather. Thank you for the conversation. Deep bows
  • George: I enjoyed it also.. thanks Heather

Comments

comments

Jorge Kapa

The speaker is never important but you may examine the message, if you wish

11 Comments

  1. I have heard it said this way….Trying to create peace is like trying to reach still water in a motor boat. The very act of trying to get there creates a barrier to it. Is that kind of what you meant?

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